You ready to record? I guess so.
Time is 6 38 the date is Monday, April the 29, th 2,024. This is the steering committee meeting or slug corporation, I guess.
Sleeping incorporated. St. Louis Linux, Unix users group. Let's see, got a small crowd tonight.
So we'll get going. See, Stan, if I don't get Kenny.
Can we prevail on you to, . Yeah
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I mean, remember how to turn my sharing on.
Right.
By the way, it looks to me like the the browser version of of Zoom here, they seem to have changed the screen.
I see. See new icons. Yeah, Steve said there's a new client out there. Okay.
It didn't bitch about mine when I started, so.
Yeah.
Somebody's being politically correct. I notice now it all, well, it always has. Shouldn't say always, but for some time it's been coming up with default language.
Ask you which language you want for captions. But it starts out with a vault of Arabic since it's the 1st in the alphabet.
Back would probably. 90%.
أوكي.
فوز نفسك شوي.
سكن يا سيدي.
نعم.
خوسنا يا.
عندي شي سويتش شتين قلته.
Did Steve drop off?
No, he went to feed his face.
You should be back, Charlie. I asked him what he was what his presentation was this month and he kind of kinda started him on.
Okay.
There's your report.
Hey, Jim.
That's a problem. On the steps.
Okay.
Okay. Okay.
See That same issue, I can't.
A few options.
Hmm, calendar report. I went ahead and counted March. We didn't have it here last time.
And, 3 48 April. It's 3 15 as of today.
Beaten numbers for the calendar. For the report.
Meet up 9 77. I said. 27. Last night, really.
Hot and heavy, lot of people signing up. You see about 2, maybe 3 people join a meeting.
Okay, we drop one off and mouse. 3 offer discuss and, steer common cis admin in the same.
The attendance report. We had 4 people. But there's staring to many last, you know, personal months.
Only I had at least 6 people at SWAC meeting. But the recording. There's about on me.
So I got a screenshot at the beginning and that was about it. Think I what happened was I round up.
Double entry thing and erase the wrong thing, I think. Not a smooth meeting was 22. St.
Louis Linux was 24. New log meeting was 14. Take a back up, that's good.
I'm sorry, Stan, what, I didn't understand that something got erased and
I think what happens, I started it twice and then When I turn it both off, I erase the wrong one.
Oh, I see. Okay.
And
Yeah, that way you lost count. You said. Gotcha.
Yeah, yeah. I'm thinking there were 10, maybe 11 people there, but only got 6 names that I knew they were there for sure.
Okay.
Okay. Whatever. And I asked Phil, he remembered who was there and he couldn't remember.
But like I said, I think it was probably about 11 people, 10, maybe 11 people. And Yeah, but I don't remember who they heck they were.
This is, April. Meeting review, anything you say about the April Steering Committee.
Anybody wanna say anything?
Ken served as our secretary.
Okay.
That was last month.
Correct.
Anything about.
Stan is serving as acting secretary. Yes.
That's Assist. Well, that was.
I have been under that. Yeah.
Not the Slack meeting.
Yes.
Yeah.
Okay.
It's done.
Song did that. Comments about it.
Pretty informative.
Okay.
Yeah. Okay. Oh yeah, yeah. Meet, need toy.
Very, very good. Yeah.
That's that's the second time that That was the second meeting in a row where I was, something that doesn't really work.
Ha!
Some AI thing that doesn't really work.
So.
I'm sorry, say that again. I did quick touch that.
Sean, that sounds like the plot of most science fiction movies. Oh yeah, there's a AI idea and it's not exactly working right.
Yeah.
Well, the one I did before that was a retrieval augment to generation and that one barely worked and now the screenshot to code that one didn't work too well either so Yeah, these AI tools are all still really early and not that functional yet.
Lisa, I use them. So.
Yeah.
Well, haven't you ever heard the expression garbage in garbage out? Yeah, you don't feed it the right data.
You can't expect it to produce the right answer.
Well, they only feed it the whole internet. I mean, come on, and not enough.
Yeah. Well, for that you gotta pay dearly because It can't create a, you know, for that size, LLM, you probably need half of Amazon.
I've bored Stan with this before, but for the other 3 of you, you got to hear this.
Did any of you watch a show called Next? It was on Fox about 3 years ago.
Nope.
I don't remember. It got absolutely 0 publicity. I just happened to stumble on it.
And it use the word next in the same type font. Or typeface that. Steve Jobs company that Apple bought the same typeface is a next company used.
The plot of the show. Was this this guy had quit his job he owned part of a Enterprise.
Company that was working on computer stuff. And Yeah, health problems so you quit and left it to his brother to run the company.
And so all of a sudden he gets contacted. I want his old engineers. The guy tells me, kind of tell you something, it's important about what was going on at work and the guy winds up being killed in the traffic accident before I can meet.
And so he starts following up on it and it starts smelling really funny. He gets a cop involved in it, it turns out that well, maybe his, you know, fancy new Tesla or whatever it was and it's got all these electronic features.
It's it's on the internet You know you could take over the car. By the internet actually you know screw up a searing and his brakes have an accident. Kill him.
And so he and the cops go and talk to the guy's brother at the company. And He says, you cancelled that AI project.
He said, you're gonna cancel it. Well, we didn't really cancel it's still being worked on up on the 5th floor.
Oh yeah? We go, yeah, but it can't connect to the internet. No, we saw that.
It's not on the internet. So he and the cop go up there and start talking to a couple engineers up there.
One of the engineers sitting over at the corner, he's sweating bullets. And the cop notices goes over and starts talking to him and and finds out that well the engineer has a gambling problem.
So one day he's talking to the AI and the AI says, oh, you like to gamble?
Sure. Here, bet on this. Bet on that. He starts giving him some good gambling tips.
And one day he says, you know, you know, I was only connected to the internet. I could give you much better tips.
Yeah.
Employee makes a act private connection to the internet for the AI. The AI basically is taking over everything. It was really a well done show and it only lasted one season because like I said no publicity and you know I think the most delicate god is I think I put it out on discuss one day but anyway shame it didn't start like 2 years later it would have been really popular but Anyway, moving on.
Back to what we were talking about. Yeah, Shawn, that was really a good talk.
I really enjoyed it. A lot of good information.
If I remember right.
I saw a guy.
Go ahead, Steve.
Hmm. Give me a and I got a mouthful of sandwich.
Okay. Okay.
Trying to think back. I think Sean, I think there were a bunch of good slides. I remember I had that presentation too.
But. Let's see a guy talking. He says, oh yeah, AI is handy. He says, I use chat GPT all the time.
This is, but you gotta be careful. He says it lies at least 20% of the time.
He says, I've got that documented.
There might be some political bias in it.
A part of that is, you know. Ch GPT is basically surfing the web and So whatever the bias.
In the web is. Yeah, he's gonna pick up the same bias.
No.
Okay. Guys, a psychologist. He asked it to write up. Laudatory poem about Biden.
And it did. They said ask it the same question substitute Trump's name.
And the response was, well, I can't do that.
Oh wow.
Make sure you think somebody's.
Everybody that writes algorithms has a bias in it, you know?
Okay. Let's see. So what's our next talk from last month?
I mean, the virtualization shootout.
Yeah, yeah.
Can you read the screen, Gary? You got your glasses with you?
Oh yeah! There we go.
Okay, any comments on the virtualization?
I don't think that I don't think Lee gets credit for that one. Okay. Lead it like 2 slides and 5 min.
Then everybody just started yakking and he couldn't even talk anymore.
I didn't want to talk. I want to listen. Hmm. I think it worked out pretty good.
Okay.
We're still giving credit here on the on the minutes and agenda in front of us on the screen.
Yes, I am reading the screen. It still says Roberts. It's actually this. I don't think Robert even made the.
Okay, I'm going to.
Hey, on the screen. But 5 lines.
Okay, It does. It's virtualization roundtable by Robert Sitck.
Says next line says however withdrawn because of scheduling conflict.
Stay in your talk. You're typing.
That's, that's a comment. That was, that was a comment in the 1st of April.
Yeah.
Okay.
Look further up. I said status done. What? Virtually shoot out by volunteers.
Okay.
Robert should that comment was, was 2 months ago. That didn't apply to what happened.
What was presented.
That's okay, Gary's never seen this before. Where, where, okay, where's the?
Well, that's got a date right in private 2 months ago. Okay. And this is the May comments.
And here is the actual presentation up here.
Oh, there it is. Okay. Perfect.
Well, sure on the note that we have a comment from March. No comments at the market. But we're already talking about April here.
Hey, April 1st was the last, Steercom meeting.
Right. Yeah.
Yeah.
And. And. Can you? Do you know, Gary, do you understand the concept of time?
Jesus Christ.
No. Okay, see that's current and there's March Steercom, April Steercom, May steer.
Okay, so there's a large comment because it was being planned in March. Okay, all right Okay, I got you.
Okay, I'm with the program.
Okay, that's scary. Yeah, it is. Anyway, we all feel we learn something about virtualization.
Anything we could have followed up on there?
I thought there was a lot of participants and a lot of information and they just kind of was it. Kind of covered all the All bases on a lot of stuff, I think.
I don't know. I can't remember what I had for breakfast, so don't count on me.
Summarize anything anymore.
We feel it was worthwhile. And anybody remember anything specific that they would have liked to have seen followed up upon?
No. I can't remember anything. Is that count?
Okay, not hearing you. Okay. Yeah, at counts. Okay, move it on.
No.
I remember a lot of agreeing agreeing with each other using different words.
Yeah.
I didn't finish these notes because I was Why not to it?
So what's Dan is currently typing is we got. Andrew Denner from CIA log.
And now I'm locked up.
Oh Captured be sure and save your buffer. Yeah.
Well, you got your swap file. Just restart. You should be able to recover.
So I'll just check chat.
Hmm.
Doing the technical there. So yeah, that was a real last minute thing. The I, I meant to call dinner the day before.
I forgot CIA log schedule. So CIA basically holds their meeting on Wednesday night. Night before. The St.
Louis Love meeting. And I literally called dinner. As he was starting their meeting up in Iowa and said, hey, it's Xe compression thing.
You got a talk all set that you're gonna do at the or that you had done at CIA login.
He said, well, actually. It's not done yet. We're just, just about to start doing it.
So I got him to agree to do it again the next night. So, I felt bad but it all worked out very well.
I thought you did a really nice presentation. I mean there was I still want to go back because he put enough technical information in there that I mean, it was really.
I gotta go back and look at his slides and listen again. I didn't understand it all, but it wasn't because He didn't get down and dirty with us.
He did. He gave a lot of technical.
And definitely that was one of the most timely talks. We've ever had. Those of you who may or may not remember.
That that had just hit the news. I want to say the 23rd of March. And, that's when it 1st got revealed that it was out there and, people started reacting to it.
So yeah, That was like 3 weeks.
Yeah, the only thing more time, with Scott's presentation. On AI. We did it in like November and then that everything hit the fan the end of December.
Thank you. I thought you gonna say Scott's presentation on the timeline of computing in 19 sixties.
No.
Alrighty, say, yeah, yeah, I think that worked out really well. Andrew didn't mind doing it again.
In fact, he kind of joked that, hey, okay. Just made the CIA log the the Shakedown cruise, kind of.
Let them, get the bugs out of the talk.
Yeah, that was a good talk.
I wonder, has anybody?
Published anything saying it You know, it almost got released.
Yeah, you know, I
Did it did it get killed? We got out there.
Yeah, just a few places that started using that release and, seems like everybody's happy that the word got out and The infected releases have been pulled.
But, I think long term is going to be serious questions about credentials or just who the hell.
Or authorized contributors to open source software.
Yeah.
And I think from what Denner said last. Time and Okay, the implication is this was.
Complicated enough that it smells like they're probably was a nation state. Involved in developing this.
So it'll be interesting to see if anybody ever. Uncovers who Who the real call for it was.
Yeah, I think there's a new system D release. 2 or 3 days ago, I think, and or at least a released candidate for a new system D.
And one of the lines in there was about mitigation of this kind of thing. Going forward so I think they already had planned on doing this thing.
Back before they knew about EC, but I think they kind of. Double timed it once this came out.
That makes sense.
But yeah, I thought it was a good talk. I thought.
A lot of really good participation. I think this is another one not as bad as the virtualization one, but this is another one where You know, Andrew went through his slides and then it was like another, you know, 30 min of,
A really good conversation. You know, around the slides, you know. Which I think is good because this is And, you know, from my point of view.
You know, emphasizing the interactivity and the conversation is really, Well, we should be emphasizing the most as a, you know, in person meet up or a live meet up with other people because If you just wanna learn the most information you can about since.
You know, I'm sure there's a YouTube video, you know, somebody, you know, has prepared and Took a lot of time and went over all the excruciating details of the ton of cool graphics and stuff.
And so if you just want the most information about the topic you can get, then you know go to YouTube.
But if you want like live discussion and debate with other actual humans who are also interested in this, this is where the meetup, you can only get that like at a meet up or something like that.
So. You know, I really think that talks to like emphasize the those aspects. Or really maybe what we should strive for a little bit.
And I think we've been doing that the last month's meetings with a lot of discussion more than lecture.
In some parts. So I like that.
That reflects. Some of the discussion. Expressions that were given at the new Linux meeting the the following week.
A lot of the regular participants express their appreciation for This type of free format relaxed meeting structure. That was in the new Linux and the Slack meetings.
And I think what we've done with some of the, the shootouts and the
Some of the base. Presentations and some of the.
Others. A number of participants and it's kind of a round table kind of discussion. I just really appreciate it.
We don't see that in a lot of places, I think.
Yeah. It's kinda true, yeah.
Okay.
Alright, under the meeting schedule.
Okay.
Here.
Black at its usual date?
Yeah. 1st Thursday.
I don't see. Any problems?
It all has been able to.
Okay.
Next.
There. Anything lined up for this live meeting, Gary?
Hey, I'm gonna skip the base for a second and talk about the main.
And, So, Craig Boocheck. Our farmer president and long time number.
Of course now he lives out in Silicon Valley. But, if any of you would like, I can put it up, I guess, from mine, but if you wanna pull it up yourself.
Go to Blue Ridge ruby.com.
And if you click on the speakers button up at the top. Of the screen. Once again, that's Blue Ridge Ruby.
Dot com.
And under speakers the upper left upper right hand corner is Craig. So. And.
Let me reach what?
Craig is his name is there. And if you click on, his name, it'll tell you what his talks about.
Also tell you about Craig. So. Craig's gonna give a talk on nothing.
Actually getting a talk on Mill. Nothing is easy.
Where am I supposed to be?
Go to Blue Ridge ruby.com. And hit speakers.
That is what I asked you.
No.
Blue Ridge ruby.com.
It's speakers. Yeah.
Okay, Gary, you sent me this guy Brian's picture.
That was a in your text you sent me Brian's picture not Craig.
Okay. Okay.
Now what?
Click on the comment. Yeah, click on Craig. And you'll see this topic.
And nail nothing as easy as it. So that that is the talk that Craig is going to be doing at the end of May for the Ruby group.
And he was offering to do a trial run of doing the talk for us. Obviously, it's not a, talk about Unix as such, not a talk about open source as such.
But the concept of nil. Of how and computing. You pulled something out as nothing.
So, It's kind of an abstract idea, but maybe it is good that those of us in the business know that's something you have to deal with in programming.
Talking about null objects or no data.
Yeah, it's good to know about concepts like that, yes.
So I have been, I sent a message to Craig last week to ask him how the talk was coming and is he ready to present it?
Didn't hear anything. Tried to reach Craig today and. I have not yet heard back from him.
So he's giving me nil. Oh, so he's doing excellent research for his talk.
But at this point, I'm, I guess I'm presuming that he is still.
Going to do the talk for us. So, I guess we'll work on that presumption that he'll be.
Available to do the Wednesday talk. So that's. That's what we're pushing on at the moment.
So that that's our our Wednesday main topic speaker.
Currently I have nothing, not a. Ready for the basic tutorial Grant offered to do some tutorials on Wireshark and TCP.
Oh cool and I just asked him. You know, don't worry about a presentation. How about some practical?
Problem solving. Yeah, you know what should be kind of tutorial size. Yeah
So hopefully, that'll work out. I keep trying to tell people, you know, for that tutorial session, you know, yeah, We set aside a half hour for it, but if you get 15 min presentation.
There's always enough questions. Well, once we start asking questions, I not worth that.
I doubt it would be a short topic. But the point is we don't need a presentation. We need practical problem solving.
That, what I'm thinking.
Can you? Yeah, I was, I had to see, I'm email them. Okay.
It's you should have read what it transcribed. So it's kinda crazy.
We put per base anything.
Put it in tentative.
You know, practical problem shoving with wireshark, TCP dump, etc.
Grant. Last name, or something like that.
Yeah.
Excuse me.
Practical? How about practical? Bless you. He's at night.
There you go.
Thank you.
That look right.
Yeah, tentative right now.
Yeah. Okay.
No, put his, presentation in there from the Okay.
Saint Louis Linux group. Available.
Hey, for the St. Louis Linux group, Scott Grammar. It will do.
Timeline of computing in the 1980.
And yes. I. Have thought to try and get someone else to do something, but.
Scott offered and
I don't have a better, I shouldn't say I don't have a better, that sounds wrong.
Shall do a great job. Yeah.
I mean, Scott himself even offered this really Should we be doing this for the log meeting? It's not really Linux, but,
Didn't have a different idea.
There's a lot of guys that they just can do it better on a Thursday than a Wednesday for the match too.
Yeah, Following presentation, but different days. Right.
I don't I don't I don't think there's a problem with it.
Yes.
Okay.
Thanks. Okay.
Yeah.
Comments? You watch.
You make the comment that this is, kind of. The next decade follow on to the talk that he did, 2 months ago.
Hey, new Linux meeting.
No foreseeable problems. Thanks long as a lot of regular guys keep showing up like Sean.
And the guy from British Columbia. And Tony C as long as those guys show up they're they're really helpful with the newcomers.
Okay.
You know, they, you know, somebody throw something out. There's another 3 solutions and 2 of them are a lot simpler than the 1st one.
That it works great.
I guess there's a different Shawn that you're talking about because I've never been I've never actually attended the new log.
So this is a different show you're talking about.
Yeah, I think so.
Okay, good.
This is the AI that's been impersonating you, Shawn.
Yeah, it's got your social security number, so be wary.
Well, yeah, after United last week, I'm sure everybody's got it now.
The internet is, the internet has had my birthday and since security number since. 20 over. 21 5. Thereabouts.
20 0 7. I did a security job up in DC and 20 0 5. And 2 years later, OPM got hacked and they got the.
The security clearance papers, I feel that 12 page pages of my history. And everybody I knew and what my dog's name and where I lived and what color the house was.
Oh my gosh.
Along with my fingerprints. It's all out there. This last week I Got off my butt and I locked down my, credit.
I'll 3, yeah, stations.
Throw is all my credit.
I have an idea for a talk, but I think I'm gonna have to wait till probably like July, cause I got a lot of stuff coming up in May and June.
Okay.
We appreciate whenever you. Stick your foot in your mouth. I mean, volunteer.
Yeah.
Well, you know, there's just so many, AI tools right now that don't really work that are fun to play with.
Yeah.
So I got a couple more lined up for another talk or I want to try to couple more and We can explore how these ones don't work and in the upcoming talk in July.
So.
Yeah.
Yeah. It works well when somebody has a problem and they show what they did to explore it.
Does that affect? Wendell Barber showed up this last meeting. And.
He had done some presentations before where he just started out with this my problem. And he showed what he did and how far he got.
And usually the things he did were not the best solution, but he got a lot of participation and it was interesting to show.
That, how he did things. And I keep saying that. At any of these meetings, half the guys in show up could do a base presentation, the drop of the hat.
They just won't do it.
I don't know if they're afraid or what or maybe. Maybe just lazy. Or well, I shouldn't say lazy.
Some of them have real jobs and they got other things you have to worry about.
You should.
And I don't know where the button is.
So the AI tools that I'm interested in this time are like, so GitHub co-pilot.
It's like a coding assistant. But now they have it to where it'll work on the terminal.
So there's a command line thing you can run. And you can ask GitHub co-pilot to like, hey, how do I do this on a Linux system?
And it'll tell you the commands to run and you can like hit a key combination. And it'll run those commands.
But it doesn't run until you, And so you hit that key combo.
Otherwise it'll just suggest how to do it. So that way you don't RMR after your machine or something like that.
Okay.
But, Yeah, it seems pretty cool. And what I was thinking, my gimmick for the talk was I was gonna go through.
Like maybe the Discuss archive or something and find some questions where people have asked like how to do something on the command line and then I would use those as my examples for.
To see if the AI can solve it. And then we can laugh at all those people and say, see, you should just ask it up co pilot.
So anyway, but there's also an open source tool called TML, which is like the open source kind of trying to do the same thing as the copilot one.
So that'll be that'll be 2 the 2 tools we can compare and see how they both perform the free open source one versus the paid One from Microsoft, so that might be a little bit interesting.
Okay, getting into June. As Lee said, he will be out of town, might be able to connect remotely, but he won't be running from the, so I presume that I will be the guide starting the.
The the meeting I guess. Alright.
Yeah. Sounds right.
I get, I guess, I don't know.
Well, you're moving forward, Sean. You were saying really great stuff. And however that's all stuff for July.
And I'm gonna suggest that, we just. Capture the. Titles you were suggesting right now and later tomorrow or something.
Stan and I will go back and look at the transcripts of the closed caption and pull out the details of what you were talking about to incorporate into the minutes.
Okay.
Yep, sounds good.
That's coming up for July and we're still in June.
Well, have you got anything lined up for Jim?
Okay. Anything in the Slack? But the Slack meeting that needs to be. Okay.
No.
Sloop meeting. Yes, I have something. What is it?
What?
Oh, Scott, I have been bothered a number of times. By the world of social media and you know okay what are the appropriate things for techies so social media for techies Here's the title.
And it will be done by Scott Brandon.
Right, wait a minute. Are you saying that?
2 of them and 2 of them 2 or 3 weeks apart. Yeah.
Oh, wait a minute.
May meeting. Main topic.
Thank you, Hey, topic. Hey, topic.
Okay, cause I was going to say you can't expect Scott to do a base anymore.
Hello? I've got this confused actually. This is actually for the, let's see, we're talking about May, right?
No.
No, you said we already jumped into, I asked you before about.
It's a bit.
Yeah, yeah.
Okay, no, you're right. This, this is the, Yeah, this is June main topic.
Alright, June May topic. Hmm.
What?
Social. Oh, so, tentative. Well, you can say tentative. You trying in status, I believe.
What the fuck?
No thanks.
Okay. This is
Okay, the title, the what? Is social media for techies.
Yeah, the idea is for synopsis, you know. Why use which social media?
But after that you can put something like a discord question mark slack question mark
And although I think a number of you've heard me gripe about My dislike of social media.
A perfect example was just this weekend. Danforth Plant Science Center.
As part of their whatever their event was on Saturday. They hosted the raspberry pi festival or whatever the annual event is, it happens.
And I looked at the Danforth Plant Sciences website less than a month ago to see if there's anything that belong on our calendar.
Didn't mention a thing about their event on Saturday on their website. And, so when somebody told me that's what happened during the day on Saturday, I said, We didn't know about it.
Why not? And they said, well, were you on Discord? We talked about it on Discord, Yes.
Oh.
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Another, another thing that, Hi visited my cousin in August.
He was on hospice with cancer. I visited him on the 21.st He died on the 28.th
Nobody called me. Nothing was put out. Oh, we announced it on Facebook. Oh, kiss my left foot.
I don't do Facebook.
Yeah.
You know, and you know. My younger brother, he was on Facebook and you only reason he was on Facebook was because his kids were on Facebook.
Here we are. We had no need for it. Otherwise. It's just that they are stove pipes.
If you're in a right stove pipe. You're talking to people. You know, their friend, your friends and neighbors, if they're there.
But it's not It's not like a web page or anything like that or slot night, you know, like a mailing list.
It's just different. It's all damn different. Every bit of it.
Nice.
And, you know, in, having with Scott. He's got some opinions, you know, like good.
Discord does have a search function, but it's extremely. Inefficient? Maybe the right word?
You gotta know which discord to be. Exactly. You know, I got, you know, I'm on, I'm on discord here.
I've been on here for years. I got. Come on, load.
1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7.
Sure.
There's nothing in anything that I know of to everybody on this court.
Right.
Yeah, because there is no such thing as one discord. There are thousands of quote unquote servers which are basically forums with all kinds of subforms.
Right.
Social media sucks.
So anyway, I think you all have a feeling. Of issues are and Scott, hopefully can, can kind of.
You all together and make it into some sort of presentation for us.
Okay, so that's what's up for the, main talk. Again, I have no,
Have no, tutorial set up for that yet.
Okay, going on to. The St. Louis log meeting for Bye.
I'm sorry, June.
Not. May, June.
Available.
Okay, tentative. Would be Alex toll?
You know, it offered, to do a talk on, loading the libraries.
Our language libraries into Linux. And, so, you know, 2, thoughts here.
1st of all, those of you who don't know about the RL language, our language is something that's used for statistics.
And, it's been. Very much replacing SAS, SAS and.
Other statistical packages. So it is the current. Anything in the world of statistics.
So yeah, it's good to know something about the our language. The talk, however, is about how to build libraries in that language and make them available in Linux in particular.
So yes, for our group of, you know, perhaps the important thing here is the learning of how to build libraries, what they're useful for, and how to do it in Linux.
So, as a secondary thing. I'll point out, Stan, if you want to put this part, in the synopsis or in the notes.
That they're There was before the age of COVID. And extremely active are Oh, user group and meet up.
They used to meet every month they pull in. 50 people for face to face on site meeting. And there'd always be one or 2.
Oh, job recruiters should be there, would be buying dinners. And, when the age of COVID hit, basically they just came to a screeching hall, haven't met since.
So I'm going to suggest to the guy who It's still the manager of that group that you might want to co-host it with us or at least make sure.
The size of their group. That put it out to a few 100 people for sure. Also, the There's a separate our women's group are a ladies, actually these what they call themselves.
And even though the main R group has fallen apart. I should say falling apart with suspended operations. The Our Ladies Group religiously continued to meet through COVID.
And they've still been very active. And I'll make the same offer to them, but they would like to co-host our at least 7 people.
I'll tell you a quick funny story about the Our Ladies group. Before COVID I was actually going to their meetings which were face to face.
And, yes. There usually was only me or maybe one or 2 other males in the.
And, I really got the evil eye from a couple of women in one of the meeting.
Finally just looked up and he's just boy stop and said what the hell are you doing here? This is a ladies group and one of the co-founders of the group.
Faculty member who knew me. And she came by defense right away and said He's cool. He belongs here.
He knows a lot about art. It was like, thank you.
But anyway, so that's part of my idea is that may bring in some new, some new people to our group.
I have sent messages to Alex. Both today and also. Believe it was early last week. And he has not responded.
Guessing that that may be because it's the end of the semester and you may be knows down doing stuff.
At the end of the semester.
What was that last statement?
Oh, that I've I have both today and last week. Tried to contact Alex to get a confirmation.
But he has not responded but I suspect that's because He's heads down working on something for the end of the semester.
I'm gonna have to drop off here in a minute or 2, but I just wanted to give another update if you don't mind about the website.
And this doesn't have to be in the in the notes or anything but just So.
Ed, and I have been working on the, the new website a little bit.
And he has asked me to make some changes to make it better work with his screen reader and stuff like that.
And so I did that and I feel like Yeah, he sent me an email this morning. So I think he's pretty much.
Happy with the results now so the website seems to be pretty accessible for people with screen readers so That part's pretty good.
What I'm working on now is I'm trying to get the formatting down. For the Like what information we need.
For each meeting because that information will turn into a web page, right? And so I want to, as much as I can.
Get that format really locked down. Because if we're gonna have, you know, 25 of these files every year, that's gonna add up really quickly.
And then if we need to make a change, later going back and changing, you know, 24 or whatever files a year for all the previous years or however many, you know, meetings are on the website that would be really tedious.
And so I'm really footing a lot of trying to put a lot of work and a lot of forethought in what should the required information be.
For each page. As far as the meeting information. And so that's what I've been spending a lot of my time on doing is figuring.
But.
Figuring that out. So if you're looking at the URL website. Not a lot of active movement there, but if you're looking at the URL to screen reader, then we've seen some progress.
And then I'll just allow it just more. Back end stuff. I try to figure out the formats.
How did you do?
So there's still a ton of work and a ton of hurdles to overcome before this can.
Be suitable for any type of main site. But, you know, progress is steady, I'd say, but still a lot to do.
So.
I have a question for you. What database is involved in all this?
Okay.
There's no database. The information for the meetings are just in flat files and I'm trying to determine right now if there should be.
Okay.
Formatted in or JSON. I'm trying to figure out which one. Would be the best.
The reason I asked is that on the wiki page I noticed it said we were using.
My sequel, I think we're actually using Maria dB.
Same thing.
Oh, why not the same thing? They're pretty much the same, but
Well, the, yeah, it's called My Sequel from, both. For Maria dB, it's,
I understand that, but there are tiny little changes with the differences with everything.
At least or have been in the past.
Okay.
I wanna get, by the way, Lee, I wanna get with you offline about the database because I need that.
I lost my password. I don't know where I quit.
Yeah. Well,
I've been using, you can key pass for the last 10 years and I don't.
I looked in there, I went through all 800 entries and I didn't find it anywhere.
Wow. Sean remind me of besides you and and Who else has been working on the? Website project.
See?
Well, Tony, Tony. I don't know his last name, Tony C. He emailed and said that he was interested.
And doing something and I asked them well what do you wanna do and he hasn't responded so But now other than that, it's just been me and Ed and Ed hasn't really done.
He's just been like telling me how to make it more accessible. Going through like the astro tutorial and stuff to try to figure out.
How we can help that way so so all the code has just been me. So far.
And the the only gathering of the group basically that has been by email.
Sorry.
Well, yeah. You know, with just 3 of us, email is, sufficient, you know, So.
Don't want to keep you any longer. Thank you.
Yeah, thank you, Sean. And I usually say at the beginning of the meeting, if anybody, you know, wants to change the order of going through things.
So don't feel bad about, saying you gotta go and. And saying, hey, let me drop this into the things first.st
So good. Thank you.
Alrighty, talk to you, thanks.
Great, bye.
Okay.
Yeah.
U Linux.
No, you.
Okay.
Any whole business.
On the, server admin.
I will declare that I haven't read anything in the last 3 months because it's too overwhelming.
Gary, you're muted. Steve, you're muted.
Yeah. Let's see. Lee, you're probably the.
The one in It's current discussion. You probably would know the most about that the air, server status.
Nothing happened.
I was in Mike, turning rocks over and finding lizards and stuff. Right.
Yeah, but that's on the original
Okay, yeah.
You know, basically at this point we're fighting through male man. Issues, possibilities and options.
And we haven't started doing much on the upgrade at this point.
Except I'm keeping both upgraded as we see the.
You upgrade notices every month. Which, by the way, Mike Knight. It did originally.
So he needs to get credit for.
I'm sorry, I was distracted by a bright and shiny object here.
Okay. Where'd you leave off?
Alright.
Where is it?
You're analyzing current Email slash mailman. Configuration and traffic.
That like you said.
And you might make a comment under that. Some great discussions on the system and mail list in case anybody is interested in.
This kind of sausage.
Yeah, that'll work.
Anything we should specifically talk to Bach upgrade. You, you said you'd be.
Yeah, current efforts are focused on
Mail man 2 analysis. So we have a good understanding of. What mailman too is doing to transfer into the mailman 3 world.
Just put 2, capital 2 and capital 3.
We all know what I, what I wrote. Yeah. Okay.
Just in front of the period put migration.
Space migration. Nice.
What kind of migration?
That's fine.
Wow.
Website maintenance.
Let's see, I guess really, So let me suggest I'll try and go back to the.
Close caption. Where about looking for transcript?
And I'll try and pull out what Sean told us before. He got off off the meat.
Try and pull that out, put it in the minutes.
Okay, well. Okay.
Website. Are you talking about the
The upgrade stuff he's working on, right?
Huh.
Not talking about the current stuff that I do.
No.
Okay. Alright. Okay.
You got current stuff that you want up. That you could put in that line.
No, I don't I don't know. I do so damn much. I don't know what the hell I do and when I do it
Yeah.
Yeah. Okay.
I was talking to Ed earlier today and mentioned that we had a steering committee meeting tonight and he said, oh, I didn't know that.
Apparently, he didn't know when they were. And I, he said, can you send me the link?
And I said, no, I sent him I forwarded the link to him, but he didn't show up.
So I don't know what the deal is. I guess he's like my cousin you have to call him and tell him you send him an email.
Yeah.
Whatever.
When you have on the phone, they'll say, good, send me an email, remind me that.
Okay.
Yeah.
Yeah, I did that's why I'm calling you Anyway.
Good day.
Okay. Uploading presentations. I haven't uploaded as well. I've done the the normal stuff.
And.
Okay. I have not done anything new.
But I think as soon as I may go start doing it again because As I understand what I should have asked this when Sean was here.
But I don't think what he's doing has any relation to what the hell is showing up on.
YouTube. Really?
Okay.
Website meeting meetup.com maintenance. Anything?
Larry.
I don't have anything for it.
I guess the usual bitch mode is crap that you know that They change stuff and
And maybe it just means I need to. Pay more attention to their I don't even know where, how I'm sure there's some kind of a a list that tells you how to be a better administrator and I just don't participate in it.
Oh, there have been a couple of, postings out there that I'm meant to mention to the group.
So our group in general. Kubernetes and cloud native. St. Louis.
Was putting out a warning for almost a month that there is no group organizer and then it would be put to sleep.
If no one stepped up. Oh, I didn't check to see if it's gone now, but, as of last week, it was down to its last 2 days.
And no one has stepped up.
Well, you could have posted better discuss or something like that, you know.
Good now and I just didn't do it.
A lot of people just don't do anything anymore. And where doing so much that it just seems to us that we're.
Not getting half of what we want to do done because we do so down much.
Yeah. Yeah.
Actually, we're ahead of what we think we are.
Another group of out there is there was a St. Louis rust group there is a St. Louis rush group.
Oh really?
And, that group trying to think of his name. Save me, he had been the leader.
And he was going to. Hold on, Lee is pointing to something. Kubernetes looks what, what the 1st one is.
Do a meet up. Impacting the future panel and International Women's Day celebration with WTM.
Oh god, that's actually the Google development group. Yeah, the Google Developer Group in St.
Louis has been taken over by the The women too, was, That, Oberfell's girlfriend, basically, Pirated it.
Who cares? Well, I mean, it would be good to have an active Android group.
But, hey, put you an extent.
Hey, can you get a presentation out of them? Does that?
Or they just they just, Let's see.
So, get me started on that. You've heard my bitch about that. One meeting. Yeah, I do a Saint Louis search on Unix in the top 3 or ours.
Could be.
Okay.
Oh well. Anyway, alright, okay. Okay, the the rest group of The rest group basically stopped meeting when the pandemic hit.
Say being moved to Europe and basically dropped out of dropped out as the organizer. And, so there have been a couple of people who had.
Ask, hey, we ever gonna do anything again? And, so finally a guy who just moved in to St.
Louis. Last spring. Because it's meet up, started saying, hey, it doesn't seem to be an organized anymore.
It's gonna go away. So he stepped up to the plate, became the organizer, but he still hasn't, He said he's got a couple presentations he's thinking of doing but he hasn't done them yet.
So I'm gonna contact him. And, tell him about slug. And, point out that yes, rust is what's now, the language of.
Wait a minute.
Linux kernel and so yeah if he comes up with a talk I'd love to know about it and we'll Off It's not the Linux kernel.
It's the, new world.
It's.
It's not the kernel, it's the GANU world, all the stuff that runs in Userland.
I thought it was also now included in the Colonel.
I thought Linus had been saying that really. There were things that he now wanted written in rust in the Colonel.
Hey, there already had been things in rust added to the Colonel, I thought.
Okay, I didn't know that.
Rust and Linux, where are we where we are and where we're going next?
What do you want me to write here for the rest group under meetup.com, make it scary.
Okay, there's a new a new group manager
Alright.
And. He has only been in St. Louis 6 months roughly. Or just a half a year.
Okay, here's where I've never heard of it. Linus gave the languages blessing for the Linux 6.1 release and Gary will.
Hey, we'll message him.
And suggest. Twenty's ready to do a rust. Presentation that We co-host it. With us.
Okay, Lee's comment.
Well, I forgot. I'm reading this. Yeah, good, good point to make.
It's not to say C is going to retire and place a rust with Russ replacing it.
It's that Russ is being added. As a better and
A better programming environment for a lot of things that
Are included in the kernel.
Interesting. I didn't know we could subscribe to tech today. For
And the clicking that you all hear in the background is Lee seeing if he tries to subscribe. To Z.
If it's going to charge you. Okay.
Oh, okay. That subscribe is ED NET or subscribe to the newsletter.
I don't know.
This stanza, our internet presence on other social media.
What the hell do we need to say here?
See
And maybe we just skipped this for now.
Yeah, just skip it for now. I mean, basically, James and Sean are the only 2 people who made any attempt to do anything there in the last couple of times they've reported that crickets There's nothing going on.
They put stuff out there and nobody. Nobody cares.
Yeah, I read that. Nothing new. But announced.
We want to say anything about hybrid meetings.
No, I said. And you say.
Hey, did we remove this, Next time.
I would. I mean, we never had, we've never had any. Movement or desire. Oh, I think it's desire just We don't have any more fingers.
No more fingers than Indians to work on it. You know, it's like.
Well, I mean, you're talking at least a thousand dollar investment in hardware. And that's half our, has not little less than half our bank account.
So. I don't, I can't see any, I can see it being worthwhile.
Move next to.
Next. Nice.
Right. Agreed? Okay.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Cameras, microphones, detectors, no change.
I still got projectors.
Yeah, I, I got it. A camera with the other ones, MI. At some point.
We might ask, if you ever seen it. Don still has the. Tomato sauce.
It's not.
Oh, you got that hard drive. That's a hard drive. I wanted back because it's got all those recordings on it.
That he did not do anything with.
If I had it back, I would try to do something with him.
It might take me 3 years, but at least I'd be doing something if I had it.
Yeah, I hear you there.
Yeah.
How about a an expedition? Go to Hey, John's house in there. Yeah. And turn his couch over and see what's underneath.
You pause the recording.
Zoom recording.
Attendance database.
No changed I know of.
I want to
I want to convert from what I'm.
We were office based.
Default database. A. DI want I need to get the password from late.
So I can start working on that. That's done some good documentation. They would help me do that.
And then, then it would be. And set it up so we had multiple people could add that stuff and I could.
Teach Gary how to put the stuff in. Teach somebody else how to put the stuff in. Hey, Stan, get runned over by the truck.
You know, we dead no water.
How are they gonna put it in without access to BACK? We don't wanna leave the database open to the world.
They'd have that you have to have a password to get in.
No, you don't leave an open port out there. You got that way to secure it.
Well.
You're right now.
How else does anybody do it? How else does anybody do a damn data basis?
You run it on on a website with SSL. And then the web code hooks the database.
Yeah?
You don't leave, you don't leave the days board open. To the world.
Yeah, that's okay. That's where I would get that's where I would have to get to eventually.
The thing.
Right. And that's, and that's how, why it stopped 5, 6, 7 years ago when you were talking about it because
Cause I didn't know enough about it. Couldn't find any documentation.
Because it takes a lot of work to.
Yeah.
Oh.
Okay.
Well, I want to do that work at this point. It might take me 3 years.
Let me.
I thought I had set up PHP my admin on there for you.
You may have. I just don't remember.
I don't see it. I don't see it.
Cause I know PHP admin is one of the tools that would be used. I know I know that much so far.
Anyway, down the road, down the road.
Down the road.
I mean, not gonna turn it out and turn it loose unless we can secure it, right? I agree with that.
100%.
We're not opening the database port to play with because that's a very significant attack vector. If you want to walk down the middle of Lindenburg Boulevard and drop your drawers.
That's your option, but I don't think we can do it on.
Okay.
I wouldn't open up anything unless you're located, okay? But I'd have to, I have to know that I can get to it when eventually.
Okay.
Whatever.
We slug offered a talk and null message. I guess that's true. I'm just looking at email here.
Oh, that's teach coming from this, guy with the funny name.
And, L, I'm at.
Yeah, you think sending it with a title and nobody in the message. So.
Okay. So, so it's junk.
Good. This junk. Or let's put it this way, I tell the intelligence.
Bye. We get too many of these guys.
Yeah, I'm sorry if that's the most intelligent. Oh, we don't wanna hear you talk.
Vantage schedule. Database.
It's still such a damn useful tool. Thank you, Sam.
Okay.
Handouts. I got a handout in mind I want to do. I've got a sample.
I just haven't had time to do it. I'm gonna make time to do it. I take telling myself.
Whatever. If I, if I get it done, it will make a great presentation and then we have a PDF for people to download.
Good.
But I just haven't got to it. Organizational papers, Gary, you know where that box is?
I have vague memories of where it is in the basement, but I haven't stuck my face into it.
I should, but I haven't.
Where did you stick your face, Gary?
There's a box of papers which showed up on my front porch it was I think over at.
Wash you when we still had the when we still had Nickelope and Bach. Living and watch.
And it was, it was a gray bar for the longest time and then they came in and put that snack bar thing in and it disappeared for a couple of years.
Okay, okay. So apparently.
And then it then it showed up at your your house, I think.
So somebody, I guess, a gray bar. You that belonged to us and came and dropped off on my porch.
And, so yeah, I basically. Took it down my basement and I keep meaning to.
Start rooting through it and have that? No.
I got a few, I got a few of those project.
Okay.
Probably a cat that lives in the box. I don't know if you guys saw the story on the news today some some couple.
Their cat like scrolling in boxes so they are shipping something back to Amazon. And the cat crawled in the box.
They didn't know it. They taped up the box. Chipped it off to Amazon. For 3 weeks this cap somehow survived.
Yeah, in the shipping crates in the, distribution center. Oh wow. It would obviously had to take the cat to the, that as soon as they found it, but, durst it back to health and.
The cat had a chip and so they were able to contact the owner and everybody is happy. So.
Yeah.
But they think the cat used up at least 8 of its lives 3 weeks. Oh my god.
Okay.
Yeah.
No kidding.
Well.
I could I could ran about that. That cat so I think I ran into Gary about it yesterday didn't I?
Remind me, it's not clicking in my brain.
The cat that was left at the gazebo.
Oh yes.
In the park.
Whatever.
There are some humans that should be put out of their misery.
Yeah, the whole planet Earth is that's an example of the planet Earth. We should get rid of the whole thing.
Sponsorship, do we need to say anything about sponsorship?
Nothing's been done.
Except for our longtime loyal sponsors like Omni-tech. Keeping our head above water.
Thank you.
And Ken Johnson. But yeah, no new information, but Ken Johnson paid for the.
Meet up.
And I should have contacted Steve Gomez and I haven't.
About what?
He sent the contribution in back in February.
Okay.
Alrighty, you can turn the recorder on.
Do business? Do you have any new business?
Let's see.
Yeah, something I would like to do that I haven't done and I'm trying. Let me.
Think for just a moment. I think I mentioned it before. So, Okay. There's a long time member.
Should be pretty astute technically.
Likeking on his name, he lives over and Oh, just west of Webster Grows.
Get to the point, Gary.
Anyway, he lost his job back in. Probably January, I think he was laid off.
They do it to me even before Christmas. But, anyway, I haven't, he hasn't come to any of the meetings since then.
I did contact them probably in February. And he basically said he hadn't found a tech job by that point and was working, as a temp at Fedex on 3rd shift.
So, anyway, if I ever get off my butt, I'd like to. Contact him to see how he's doing.
He's found another tough job.
Urge them maybe to at least show up at the meetings.
Maybe you'll find something. Yeah, you always impressed me somebody you know you wasn't
Oh, so is that something you want you to do or for everybody to help do?
Well, 1st I guess I need to contact or see how he's doing what he's up to.
You know, 1st you need to care. Yeah, it'll come to me one of us.
It's doing the meetings over. I know that how that goes.
I guess. This pissed me out. What?
Hi, I thought I didn't have a GDN account, but I said I did. So I reset the password and update the password and password vault.
But I can't find the entry. There's nothing under I looked at the recurring requirements.
It, said that, The. Oh, buddy DNS has already been paid for, already been renewed.
Yeah, it's auto on May. You let's encrypt on auto.
There's no charge for So I was going to renew. And that's, that's just a shell script that runs. Okay.
And then we usually take care of it June. You'll get the. Missouri annual report in.
She actually buy annual. No, I guess it's in because we have like
Every 2 years.
As there every 2 years.
And, we pointed out they only require every 2 years since our board of directors. Potentially changes every year.
We may need to update that.
Well, you know, he doesn't put our addresses on us, so what difference does it make?
We mean, this is on there. Everybody has an address.
Last time I looked it didn't have.
Please. We's pulling it up right now to.
2022 so yeah we got one. We got one due this year. Maybe. Everybody has an address.
Okay.
3, 3, one, North.
You understand right there? Oh, we're all the same address. It's all the, organization address.
Yeah.
Good. Yeah, and it's it was a band buying like it 2 years ago. Okay.
Just happen to think we probably should do annual because the poor changes and this might change.
Yeah, so it would be worth leaving it as an annual thought. I'll do it. I'll do it annually.
Okay, that takes us through couple of months. That's good enough for the.
For the, what we need to do, Park. Recognizing useful efforts.
We got some, folks on.
The like that have been making some good contributions. Grant T and Ron. Mike Knight, I think they deserve a kudo.
Or some kudos.
Excellent. Okay.
And, hell, Kazidi, not be so screwed up. That they gave me a password reset.
And the reset saved in my vault. But yet I can't find
I can't find the host name by which it will save. Okay. If by the host name.
There's not one year that I don't recognize. But yet it I change the password and it's saved in the vault.
But I have no idea what Earl it used to save it.
Okay.
Because the host name is not. Something with often. R.
Net.
I put down for useful efforts, Mike Knights. John Tweethouse and Grant T's.
Comments on Anything else there?
Oh, Ron.
Right.
Right. Oh, Ron BC.
Yeah.
Which is, yep.
We see stands for British Columbia. It's Canadian. Okay.
C's out there on the West Coast
I think that's it other than are we gonna do any kind of blue sky recording?
Yeah. Yeah.
Okay.
Are you shut down the recording? Okay, book end. This has been the string committee meeting for May, 2024.
The date today is April the 29.th but of course it has to be the meeting from A.
Let's see it was we stand Steve's checkman and Sean Twe house and myself, Gary Meyer.
And